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Semi guild drama... more like issues with a person.....
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unmei_no_laluna wrote in wow_ladies
bleh so annoying really but here we go....

..... You don't have a shield.

So I understand tank = good if tank = Shield + good weapon/armor.

Now my main isn't a Tank-type class. I created my first character, a lil Troll Warrior way back when I was playing the Trial version. I was still learning the game. Since getting BC I've spent all my time on my Mage Blood Elf. Since then I've added 2 hunters, a rogue a druid, and a warlock, a palidin, a name holder for when we get death knights >>

But I get back to the point. So this group consisted of a lvl 19 druid (resto), a lvl 19 warrior, a lvl 21 warrior, and a lvl 23-24 warlock.

My Palidin is speced, Prot-Ret. she's a hybrid and I love her dearly. (Horse ftw)Granted I've been training her in Polearms for a while I didn't have exactly the greatest of gear for this character.

So yeah we're going to run BFD, I've been their several times over to the point I know how the movement of the mobs go in some places are. I know how to spot the stealthed saytars before they get the jump on people. So it was all set up for me to tank when the mostly Resto Druid goings "Wait who's tanking?"

After a brief talk it was decided that the lvl 21 warrior would tank he instance.

..... I hold aggro better. I can heal myself so that's kinda one less target our healer has to worry about. but they insist. and I play the fun game of chase down mobs that run away this way the main warrior can focus on the fight and not charging after broken ones. didn't work out so hot, we wiped several times towards the end because the tank wouldn't listen when I told him to pull the mobs closer to us........ adds suck especially if their adds from a mob that ran off.

....... I mean is it really that much of a nono to tank w/o a shield? even in a place like BFD?

::edit:: okay I reread this myself and realized that :P trying to post at almost 5am while half asleep makes me post like I'm a 2 year old that can't form a complete story.... so XD

Okay so the group I went to BFD with where all members of my guild. The Druid "healer" (lvl 18/19 at start of instance) normally plays a rogue. I'm the Pali (lvl 26 at start, my main is also a mage fyi)of the group, and no I'm not the type to go "I can tank AND heal." I'm a Prot-Ret hybrid. I don't have much mana based on the type of armor I have to wear. But in case of emergency, please break glass and cast "Heal Self"

I did have a shield in bank, But at the time I had No One-handed weapon (btw yes I do have it trained, I ran around with a sword and shield for a while until I did the Pali polearm/spear quest). The armor I had on was fairly descent for all green armor, though nothing compares to having pretty blue named armor out the butt. For a character I barely play (except when to DE and Enchant other items) I wasn't too bad off, or at least that's what I was told by another guild Main character Pali who at request checked my gear over to see what I needed. (Their going to help me get better armor soon so yay, since of course room for improvement is always the case at low levels.)

Maybe it was just me that night. That is struck me as odd for them to pull this group together and invite me with the knowledge that I'm not a healidin, then tell me that they (the RestoDruid btw) would prefer a lvl 21 warrior who could only Duel Wield at the time (His shield was in the bank too) to be the primary tank. Not that a lvl 21 couldn't tank, but when you have a lvl 26 standing there shouldn't you throw the one with more HP in front to handle the groups?

I guess that's where I'm having the problem with this..... I had no one handed weapon at the time (Until I finished the quest in BFD, I dont' think it was really an improvement over my old weapon D: imo), but Since I wasn't the healer... and I wasn't the tank..... wtf should I have been doing?

I dunno maybe I'm still griping over nothing... but what can I think when my own guild mates show no faith in attempts to do something different.

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In lower level instances it's probably not going to be THAT bad, depending on what level you are, but a shield really is vital for tanking :/

I was doing pretty well with taking on a mob or two with the spear. so It wasn't that i 'couldn't' tank it.

But I have a shield now since I now have a new one handed to use. I was lvl 26 when I entered. lvl 27 when I dinged inside the instance.

but basically I was the highest lvl out of the entire group.

I tanked 9/10 instances I went to on my enhancement shaman in leather. It's not hard. At all. Seriously. People need to stop nitpicking.

It's not vital. But if I was healing a PuG tank I didn't know, I'd leave if they didn't have a shield unless their gear was very good.


I'm also leery of the pally "I'll tank *and* heal myself!" thing as well... That's just my opinion though. If the tank tanks, the healer should really only need to look out for that one person mainly. The healer shouldn't have a ton of targets if no one pulls aggro off the tank.

Well, sadly it seems like a lot of people have the idea that if the tank is doing their job, they can magically hold aggro no matter what.

lol That's true. Like I said, none of the DPS should pull aggro off the tank. I'm not one of those people that thinks that once the tank is next to it that it's open season for me to DPS it down. *grin* It's an individual party members' responsibility to be aware of the aggro they are generating in regards to the tank, and if need be, to slow down to allow the tank to stay ahead. My Feign Death button is not my 'Oh well, I pulled aggro again - stupid tank.' button. It's my 'Damn. That crit threw me over the line and I pulled the mob off the tank. *And* my trap didn't work. And now I'm being beat senseless, the tank is too busy to get this one back, and the healer is busy keeping the MT up and can't spare some heal love for me. Now I need to save my own ass.' button. lol

I agree and in my original post (pardon it for sounding bad I was tired then) I didn't mean it as a "I'll tank and heal myself" but in an emergancy I can do so if like lets say the healer is low on mana or gets aggro pulled on themselves by let's say a Patrol or something like that.

Oh, I see. :) I think that's one of a pally's very strong points. Nothing like emergency healing! A lot of people I group with want to do both though. I never ends very well.... :(

hehe I couldn't handle doing both. XD I even tend to forget about my own HP bar and when I die I go.... D: wait why didn't I heal/drink pot ....... idiot me.

lol I think everyone does that. ^^

Shields can sometimes double your armor rating and the higher your armor rating, the less damage you take. Less damage the tank takes is less mana the healer burns on keeping them alive, so there'll be less downtime for the party.

At those levels, though, people should more be concerned with whether or not the tank can keep the mobs off of the support players--it doesn't do anyone any good if that Warrior with a great Shield isn't taking the hits, and the Warlock in cloth is. Ideally you want a tank who can hold hate well and has a shield, but sometimes it's better to just have someone who can just keep everything on them.

If you really do want to tank in instances more often, you'll want to train up a 1-handed weapon and keep a shield and it in your inventory for tanking instances. Most group will not want someone tanking with a 2-hander, no matter how awesome they are, so you're going to run into this a lot.

Oh I understand that completely. I'm not disagreeing with that nor trying to say other wise.

But yeah.... the 'healers' concern didn't seem to be on who could keep the mobs off the support players. that night I actually spent more time healing the "tank" and pulling aggro off him AND the warlock.

Yeah, I didn't even start using a shield to tank stuff until I was in the fifties, and didn't get extra tank gear into the sixties. You don't really NEED shields to tank as long as you're using defensive stance, sunders, taunts, and aren't taking ridiculous loads of damage. Although you WILL want one for spellcasting mobs (though I used to just dps em down in my noobish days- I didn't learn to tank "proper" till the fifties just because I never had a problem).

But yeah, it would be pretty tricky for a 21 warrior to keep aggro off a 26 paladin, even if they were dual wielding for good damage. I don't know why they would want him to tank rather than you. Maybe they're kinda new to the game?

Actually the Druid and the Warrior have been playing WoW longer then I have....

o_o mmm I think they've been in playing (switchin from Alli to Horde and servers at one point), for about a year. Me... I got this game... 4 months.

but I use to play a Palidin Type character in an MUD. So I understand the balance of Heal/Tank fairly well.

I like to go into instances that I am in the bare minimum range for. My boyfriend (prot warrior) plays with me. Elites 5 - 9 levels above you tend to beat the shit out of you. :)

If you're tanking something 'hard' you need a shield. To me, if it's that eeasy that you don't need a shield/can tank in are probably in an instance that isn't going to give you much of a challenge. To me, I see no point in that. I like a challenge. ^^

heh I was only going in because a. I needed stuff to Disechant. and b. some guildies needed quests to be done.

^ That's for warriors, obviously, but the same shield philosophy should still hold with paladins. Especially with your Devotion Aura. A Prot/Ret spec sounds perfect for 2-hander tanking.

For what it's worth-- if you're considerably higher in level than the other person trying to tank, there's a very good chance you'll be the one to get aggro. That's not necessarily related in any way to tanking ability, but due to the fact that you will have less misses/resists etc, and will do more damage. If neither of you had a shield, i agree you should probably have been tanking... just because his taunt was more likely to be resisted.

Players can muddle through L15-50 instances without playing very well individually or as a team. Targets will rarely be marked, few, if any, members will use a threat meter, huntards won't trap, locks won't CC with a succubus, dual-wielding Fury warriors will try to tank as will pali's with 2h weapons. Nevertheless, as long as you pull and mostly focus fire you can get by most of the time. In short, your lack of a 1h weapon didn't matter in a very forgiving newbie instance. Even if you had a 1h and shield, other members of your group wouldn't have let you tank effectively. They would have all unloaded on the same mob without regard to managing threat.

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